troll was barely touched, but everyone else was buffed.
I disagree with people saying troll is dead completely, but he won't be the same in pro scene. He will still be annoying as hell in pubs.
"troll was barely touched, but everyone else was buffed."
Hahaha. Yeah. It is fun to compare the heroes now with the heroes in Dota1 during year 2007 when I started to play. All heroes are so much stronger now. Besides that they removed the possibility to do a 100% stun lock with high enough attackspeed. And that heroes with bash not can buy bash items anymore.
OK, some correction to what I said above.
When heroes was completly new then they often were stronger then they are today.
Legion commander was the strongest hero I ever seen when he was new. He could win anything 1v5 with the right items and extra damage as long as he could hit back (not stuned etc.)
PA so so much stronger today.
You could play her in APEM
But in AP she was basically useless. To slow farm and to bad when farmed.
But it was fun when she was 100% invisible to all 10 players besides her shadow pictured as a round black thing on the ground :)
Not very easy to find here even if one played her him self :)
He is utterly useless now, as I said before. I don't know how you people can think he isn't nerfed enough.
it's rather the sniper nerf that is disapointing, he was way stronger, and yet was nerfed much less.
Are you actually full time retarded or do I have to explain that the main nerf is the vision removal?
what exacly do you have in mind?
Now troll will get juked in the early game, his midgame is much weaker due to huge nerf on his ult and in lategame he gets crushed by a lot of other heroes.
He is fucking useless now. Are you planning on making troll the new alchemist?
Troll is still good since he can solo Rosh at min 8 and boost Void with his ultimate when Void use Chrono.
And Troll is still good for pushing lanes and ratting the base.
How the fuck can he solo rosh at min 8 now? Did you not read that quelling blade no longer affects rosh? That plus his 15 dmg loss drops his dmg from like 140 to around 80 at level 8 with a helm of dominator.
I did it before without that q-blade. I dont think the -15 should matter very much.
Drop from 140 to 80? I dont understand.
TBH. I didnt know QB worked on rosh. Then I could have done it on min 6 prob.
dude move on, ur dream to win mmr spamming troll is in the past.
even if he wasnt nerf, wats the point of picking troll when you can pick tuskar and make flashy playz ?
sam is always unusually angry when a patch is announced.
and not, i don't think his spells losing vising is much of an issue.
you're dumb then, the vision was what made it impossible to flee from him using trees/jukespots
also the -15 damage hurts a lot
^ troll is completely fucking dead. dont think sniper was nerfed hard enough though, will stil lbe annoying
Sniper will be fine, shrapnel nerfed, agi nerfed and headshot can now miss, he wont be able to manfight a PA without a mkb.
WHY THE FUCK IS HE DEAD.
I had to use ranged form in aggressive lanes anyway. I think only his early game ganking abilities have been nerfed and thus snowball potential has decreased.
But late game troll is fine as ever. And team utility still good.
void>troll (if u think right click bashlords) cuz of more utility. u want a strong crowdcontroller over manfighters. troll was stronk because he was stronk in every phase of the game, cuz of high base dmg, stats and ms and cuz of farming meta. recent nerf leads to ezier harrass in lane and he needs his bkb more than ever. nobody wants right click dmg this patch, so his nerfed ultimate is useless. he might be ok in certain split push (alliance style) set ups - but will be forgotten once again.
Ive often seen that in games in which i went solo offlane my troll has snowballed a lot. Since in such a lane I was always in ranged form anyway, can we make an argument for offlane troll now?
The vision changes are pretty rough... but he still manfights like a beast surely? ... and with silverblade skadi abyssal now... I'm honestly thinking he'll still be strong. I finally get to play him again though... I hate playing broken heroes but always loved trolls design... his ult is great for rat, but also for getting your fervour stacks up quick and shit ... I think he'll roughly be where he needs to be now.
"I did it before without that q-blade. I dont think the -15 should matter very much.
Drop from 140 to 80? I dont understand.
TBH. I didnt know QB worked on rosh. Then I could have done it on min 6 prob."
Troll at lvl 8 is 66 average dmg from innate agi/dmg, +20 from dominator, +15 for berserker rage, x 1.32 for qb = 133.3
New troll at lvl 8, 66 dmg + 20 from dominator = 86
Remains to be seen but rosh with just dominator is going to be very difficult and I'm not sure it can be done. And yes, you could probably do it at lvl 6 with just dominator, when I jungle troll I usually go at lvl 7 cus that's the level you max fervor and makes it a breeze around 8 mins. 2/0/4/1 build, dominate a creep ez.
And yes, I think they overnerfed troll. Idk so much about the vision changes, I guess I never realized how much that helps. But he got too many indirect nerfs via stout shield and qb nerfs combined with his direct nerfs is too much. But who knows, the entire meta is changing, he won't be shit, just not op.
Timberwolf
Welll, I guess I am happy with the new Troll. People will not pick him vs me very often But I can still pick him and use the strengths he has left.
Because you study the game and are better than everyone else. What's the secret to post patch troll? Is it multiple headdress build?
Please let us know.
I haven't actually played since the patch came out, and I'm curious to hear from someone who's actually played against the "new" troll.
yo guys allo, last patch u could pick only 10 heroes, now u can pick 100. thus troll not overbroken anymore.
I'm going to spam troll now untill they patch. I will spam him until I want to vomit when I see him.
And yes, the -15 damage was devestating if you ask me, but at least he didn't lose bonus armor and attack speed too...
also I think the nerf was good enough to seriously hinder his lane presence and ability to rosh at 10, plus all the buffs given to magic nukers and the new items and I think troll is fairly balanced for now, only time will tell though
lol i saw a sniper going moon shard and raping the ennemy. only his first skill was fixed mostly but hes not THAT good anymore cuz with all the heros buffed and items buffed he can get rekt ez
Probably sniper in my bracket tbh cus everyone's going to go that new silver blade shadowblade + sange build and blow him the fuck up cus 3ks don't buy enough detection. Unless sniper himself goes that item too in which case... where's that mind blown gif from tim and eric?
But the troll nerfs will hurt how I play him cus I go jungle -> rosh by ~8 mins, but it probably won't hurt majority of players in my bracket cus like I said, I never even realize the vision thing was big which makes me think people don't juke troll that much at 3k/he doesn't fight ranged form that much, and majority of troll's go safelane and don't ever do rosh. So big difference really is that they might miss last hits without that +15 dmg but if you just buy blades of attack before brown boots or buy a qb off the bat it's a non issue. So I see him being relatively as effective for the average player who isn't really that good with him.
You can't really ask which got more nerfed because they kinda forfilled different roles, whereas:
Troll: In your face, you can't deal with me, but you have to
Sniper: Stays in back, kills you from 9000 range, counterganks with Shrapnel, Dominates most mids, deathball, and u can't push vs him.
Overall Sniper got more nerfed, but he was also stronger than Troll in a lot of points.
With the -15 dmg on Troll, he can no longer dominate lane vs. more or less any offlaner. In 6.83, if you lost lane in offlane 1v1, you are terrible. This is no longer the case however, cause you can actually deny creeps from Troll and trade more efficiently.
Also, you can't use Axes to slow to dive heroes and see TPs coming anymore, cause u dont get the vision in case someone teleports in fog. Not to forget about smokes at night, before if smoke popped you'd just axe and see everything -> No longer the case.
I think Troll still has his place, but is way more situational, and I definetly think Sniper can still be played, but you don't have the bullshit factor of Shrapnel from 20000 range into an ultimate when you're on edge of shrapnel anymore.
If you don't think these heroes got significant nerfs, that might mean you're not very smart or good at the game.
GLHF Further, I'll not be posting here much anyways.
They are quite different, I mean sniper is shit if A) team doesn't protect him early and B) you gank him, one or the other works, usually both. and sniper had a lot more direct counters. If you didn't do any of those though he's way stronger.
A lot of troll's strength was just cus he had virtually no weaknesses. He farms bkb so fast, he moves so fast, great base dmg, nothing deals with him except good coordinated play.
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