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General DiscussionDoom, Bristel Back and Slark, how does one go about not sucking with ...

Doom, Bristel Back and Slark, how does one go about not sucking with these heroes? in General Discussion
#12

    Anyone have a link to a really good in depth guide to any of them, or just advice, or a player to watch?

    sleave

      How not to suck with Doom:
      -> Press R
      -> Click in the hero you want to kill

      How not to suck with Bristleback:
      -> Turn your back to people
      -> Press W

      about slark i cant help sry

      Dipshit

        The trick to slark is landing your pounces. That's it.

        Z__

          Slark:
          1. Farm your basic items: PT, OoV, RoB/RoA/drums.
          2. At level 8 you can kill any support in the map 1v1 (or even 1v2 if his teammate is weak). Abuse this everytime they're out of position.
          3. Choose your first big item based on your needs:
          -Shadowblade heavily punishes splitpush and people out of position and helps against bloodseeker. Gives you enough AS and dmg to snowball into another item.
          -Blink is amazing on him but most of the times you will need some help to take down foes because your dmg output is not that good.
          -SnY gives you all you need for the mid game (MS, AS, dmg and str) but it's not a good lategame item, IMO. If you're the main carry on your team better get something else.
          -Orchid is good against escapes or heavy casters.
          4. At lvl 10 you can kill most cores - abuse it.
          5. You should play very aggressively, punishing anyone who's out of position. Your passive allows you to engage, disengage to regen and re-engage in a matter of seconds, use this when fighting.
          6. Keep in mind that when dark pact is maxed out you can push waves or farm the jungle really fast without losing any mana if you tread swap.
          7. He doesn't do well in a 5v5 situation unless you're really ahead, so choose your fights carefully (and remember about point 5).

          Jaiimez

            Yea bristle is the one hero you want to be running away with!

            Dire Wolf

              Doom can be overwhelming because his builds are flexible and he can fill a ton of roles. Plus he can jungle or lane. A lot of decisions to make and a lot depends on your team and enemy's team setup. Work on your positioning and getting dooms off correctly though and you'll win a lot. If you can master blink doom you'll do quite well.

              Quick maffs

                s&y best item in this videogame

                even better on slark

                Totentanz to The King: M ...

                  It's funny how those heroes are some of the easiest in the game.

                  Hopeless

                    BristleBack needs a solo lane.

                    and stop getting nasal goo first by default. I rarely get it before level 7. You just sit offlane solo and play safe, harass and get last hits. Save your mana and only use quils for a last hit or two before level 5. once you hit level 5 you should have 0/3/2. This is when you are strongest as you are solo and they should only be level 3-4. You take control of the lane, bait them into a fight, and dump all your quills and destroy your lane. If you do it right you will be level 6-7, they wont have hit level 6 yet, and you will have beaten your lane 2v1 or 3v1. BB has a movespeed steroid at 6 and needs to be as tanky as possible with as high a quill spray level a possible as early as possible. Ain't nobody got mana for level 1 goo. Your spray has crazy range so just run after them when they bitch out. They won't realize how much damage they are taking from stacks till its too late.

                    Get goo at level 8 generally after you have 0/4/2/1 completed

                    You only get nasal goo first if you are the carry in a safe tri-lane.

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                    #12

                      Every time I pick slark I do really well in lane/early ganks, but then the other team just groups up and suddenly I cant do anything, is there a way to build him so he is less useless in team fights (BKB maybe) or should I just be shadow bladeing/ blinking in to back line kill some support with my ult active and then running away.

                      With doom it might just be terribly bad luck that I keep loosing, I usually feel like I am doing really well I will take a solo lane and still get a midas by 6 min, I will generally get a kill or two, but it always seems like every other lane just feeds super hard, even if gank them.

                      It could also have something to do with my choices of doom targets, I will go after some one on the other team with a big ult, but then they will just back off while there team fights, and then show back up mid way through the fight ready to cast their ult.
                      In pro games casters always talk about how doom "removes some one from the fight" but it never seems that way, is he only a good pick if your team has enough burst to get multiple kills before doom wheres off. Should I only target people who wont be able to back off, that feels redundant since most heroes will die pretty fast if they get in this situation in a fight?

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                      Quick maffs

                        In teamfights you need to try to go in and out with slark.

                        Go in do some damage dark pact out, go in again etc

                        That its why i like drums s&y, tanky and fast

                        Z__

                          If you have some time then watch this game:
                          http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/858498785
                          It is a low tier game and I made lots of mistakes, but it shows how can you deal with 5-manning when the enemy is ahead as slark by engaging and disengaging really fast.

                          Dire Wolf

                            What concede wrote is good advice for bristle. Goo is not needed early. Quill dmg stacks up super fast if you have full mana to spam it. If you're offlaning vs 2 or 3 people just bide your time til you have lvl 5 or 6 and that 0/3/2 or 0/3/2/1 build then unleash. Remember you are kind of vulnerable before then and don't worry too much about farm, just get dem levels!

                            I glanced at your last two bristle games zabby and doesn't look like you weren't the only one to blame (one match silencer dagon rofl) but I don't like your items. First game, you have orb of venom, vlads and looks like building a hex. Other team had a anti mage and hex is pretty good shutdown for him, but I'm not sure it's core on bristle. I don't think you should get vlads. Majority of your dmg comes from quill spam in fights. Maybe a bassy ring into vlads after you get some right click items like an AC. Orb is just not needed cus you are fast with your ult and slow them plenty with good. If you want hp regen I would seriously consider vanguard instead of lifesteal.

                            Next game, I like shivas on bb, but maelstrom with that lineup? You guys should have plenty of other dmg sources so just get tanky. And I don't like mek on bb, he has mana issues, but since no one else built it it's a good choice. Try getting vanguard and a halberd and you will be very hard to kill and do decent dmg.

                            Your doom builds look fine except for all the mjollnirs. Get tankier, like a heart or more utility like an aghs/refresher/shivas. I don't think mjollnir is that great on him. and don't be afraid to build a bkb if you need it. One game had a dagon cm, huskar and luna. Bkb will stop those heroes in their tracks. Though all your doom games look like you had one or two serious feeders.

                            You don't always have to doom the biggest ult person. Sometimes doom'ing a carry works out great cus they run away and do no dmg to you. Sometimes getting the doom initiation on anyone is better than the perfect person, like I would gladly doom lich or void or es if they're all on the same team, just doom whoever you see first.

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                            harvard graduate

                              My favorite doom build would be Phase when lane is easy/Tranquils when lane is hard into Blink. Have a centaur stun and rotate to other lanes everytime your ult is up and you have mana for a combo. If your team has another natural Mek carrier like Enigma, go straight Shivas (you may wanna get drums when there are constant fights but I really dont like it on Doom). Once you got Blink and Shiva you can basically solo any hero that is out of position just for once second. Use shivas and blink afterwards, - the frost blast will follow your hero and you get a free doom on the slowed target. After that just LVL death and scorched earth and finish the enemy off.
                              After Shivas your options really open up. I like BKB because it allows to just yolo into the enemy team without getting nuked down/stunned. AC is also nice as well as Heart.

                              Everything I said relates to offlane doom which is the role I like him to most on. Now, most people will doom that Storm/QoP instantly in every fight but I found it to be a lot more efficient if you can just doom their Mek Holder/ a critical support.

                              npc
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                                Mа§таÐøøм

                                  http://www.dotafire.com/
                                  read, win

                                  npc
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                                    #12

                                      thanks for the help guys
                                      ill try the 0,3,2 bristle back skill build, and just building Tanking items on him instead of damage utilities as concede and timber suggested.

                                      @ Oleksandr I watched a bunch of the team fights in that game, what you were doing seemed like it would work in games at my skill level. It was a lot more patient then I normally play slark (or anyone else). The team you were up against was really light on lock down though so that might have countered it. As a side not I was expecting to be pulling my hair out over missed last hits and bad positioning, but the only thing that bugged me at all about your play was your lack of boot toggling.