too much money put into someone that can be countered with 1 item. The only way to really get that much gold is to put him as either carry or mid and once you start building it the other teams supports have plenty of time to acquire a BKB. Could work in pubs tho since alot of people dont know how to adapt their item choices.
^ Do you know what happens, if you use global silance, after enemy went in, and used bkb? ( while the bkb is active )
u can BKB out of global silence and you can BKB to immune global silence. Only Doom and disruptor's ulti (with agh) can block you from using BKB
Refresher isn't needed, and an aghs rush can prove fatal to the enemy team. Outside of that, I really don't recommend either item.
@Sampson
While enemy team has bkb , and you use ulti, they got silenced.
Global silence goes through bkb
I think the idea is when you use global, you force them to BKB, then you refresher and global again, and they're silenced in BKB.
It's actually pretty legit except you're relying on getting a lot of gold (I would say Silencer needs a Force Staff as well) which is I think generally a bad way to go in pubs.
EDIT: ^Ninja'd
Global silence goes through bkb, refresher nulls everyone's bkb, even better with scepter added on
Silencer is one of the hardest anti-carries in the game
"Global silence goes through bkb, refresher nulls everyone's bkb, even better with scepter added on
Silencer is one of the hardest anti-carries in the game"
Most carries don't need their actives to slaughter you...he's the hardest anti-support in the game...
@Sampson, bkb dispels global silence but it doesn't make you immune to it.
sorta like omniknight having to repel then ga otherwise dispelling ga.
Yeah that's the downside is a right clicking carry doesn't need abilities to kill silencer, you are so squishy. But a lot of right clicking carries rely on supports to get team disables off and slow targets or else you can run away.
I don't see farm as an issue, for example this game was quite long, but I ended up with three big items plus force staff- orchid, scythe, bkb. I could easily drop scythe for refresher and bkb for aghs. I think that might have won us the game had I done that, if we had been able to prevent ember from sof' for 14 seconds gg, or I guess just 7 since he'll bkb out of first one.
http://dotabuff.com/matches/674987249
And sampson, supports never build bkb at my mmr aside from enigma for uninterrupted black holes and occasionally CM for her ult.
Anyway I don't know if it's ideal, silencer with orchid and scythe is just so deadly but it's something I think I need to try out and see how it goes.
Yeah of course you can its' a good build.
But you sacrifice early game effectiveness by rushing these 2 items?
I mean at least you could've gone force staff before getting these stuffs.
^
Last time i saw it a few days ago on Korean team.
They played Silencer as position 1 though and yeah they lost
Loda did it in a pretty high stakes match and they won, he relied heavily on S4 or Akke's force staves to save him while he would consistently disable the entire enemy team. Still top damage on both teams.
The premise was that his team had the superior initiation + team fight and all they needed was Global to secure pickoffs. BKBs would prevent this but a quick RO from Loda would counter the BKBs.
If silencer is a 1 he probably shouldn't be building utility items and should build right click int items, orchid, scythe, shivas etc.
The whole concept of the 1 position having to build right click items is simply mistaken.
It's simply about what you want to achieve with that hero.
EE played Jakiro as the safelane farmer, yet simply went for Mek and Rod of Atos. You build the items appropriate for winning, which in turn is based on the draft. A hero that has farm priority does not necessarily have to build DPS. You can give Clock safe lane farm priority for instance, and a semi-utility build of Force/Agha/Blademail lets him take on any carry late game while being as adept at picking off supports.
No of course not, I wouldn't ever suggest jakiro or clock build stuff like daedulus just cus they have farm. What I meant was if you have no right click dmg aside from silencer you probably need to have him get some. In general pub teams that have no right click dmg need to win really quickly like 20-30 mins or they end up losing long term since their nukes plateau. It's really hard to get a 5 stack on pubbers to coordinate enough to push that hard early. And silencer can do some pretty sick right click when needed.
Aghs+RO is excellent because of the extended GS duration + CotS debuff.
Looking at where the discussion is headed, I'd like to point out a few things:
1. As Zenoth has mentioned, farm priority doesn't dictate a move towards DPS-heavy items. It just means you have more flexibility to get the bigger items your team needs to win. Like Riki, Silencer's Glaives make him a fucking pain to tank if you pump the necessary stats.
2. Silencer is a snowball hero, and he needs to be in early fights so that he can sap Int. Although Alliance won with him, I feel Loda's passive early game was a major letdown. All he needs is early game survivability (personally I prefer FS/Eul+Meka). Too many times did I see skirmishes taking place with Loda farming away at the top lane when he could have been gaining Int. Granted, a well-farmed Silencer is a nightmare to deal with, but if he snowballs early, it's almost impossible to deal with him by mid game.
3. Silencer is hard countered by a BKB (unless you have a RO, in which case you're probably ballin' outta control anyways). This basically means that if the enemy team can get their BKBs up, you WILL require a secondary carry to deal physical DPS.
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Is this a good build? I almost always go orchid, mek if no one builds it, force staff, scythe. But the potential of aghs + refresher means you're doing 780 dmg cus they can't drop the dot with silencer, and 14 seconds of silence. Pretty much gg unless other team has a lot of bkb's. I guess it depends on if you want silencer to be a right click hero or utility? Orchid is just so freakin good for right click on him.